Pamela: 0:00

I remember being behind this guy and he didn't he just turns. No brake lights no light no nothing. So I said 'nice effing brake lights'. to which then she made it a song. 'Effing brake lights effing brake lights' and I was like. You're listening to Premeditated Opinions because yes we thought about it and then we said it anyway. I'm Pamela.

Josh: 0:38

And I'm Josh and we are two people who somehow share a brain and decided to weaponize our brains with microphones. Each week we unpack anything from politics and religion to carpool dread and everything in between.

Pamela: 0:50

You know it would really help us a lot if you followed us on Instagram and YouTube. Giving us a like and a follow is probably the best thing your thumbs will do today.

Josh: 0:59

We are not experts. We are just way too confident in our own opinions. With all that being said let's get started.

Pamela: 1:06

So if you notice if you're on YouTube I actually fixed my hair today. With with my hair I love my hair flip.

Josh: 1:14

Yeah she she really does.

Pamela: 1:16

I do. because Josh took the kids to school today because he is literally waiting for our new iPhones to show up.

Josh: 1:27

Right. Signature required.

Pamela: 1:28

Signature required but come on.

Josh: 1:31

Yeah

Pamela: 1:31

He's like yeah the new iPhone and he's super excited. But he called me on the way back to brag about the fact that the carpool line is no longer a thing. Like as in he literally told my daughter to tuck and roll this morning because it was moving so quickly.

Josh: 1:57

Yeah

Pamela: 1:57

And I'm like well because they listen to our podcast.

Josh: 2:01

I mean obviously. Look we're we're only we're like a month and a half into this thing and look at the influence we already have.

Pamela: 2:08

Look we're already changing road

Josh: 2:11

Changing local policy.

Pamela: 2:12

We are.

Josh: 2:12

Right.

Pamela: 2:15

We're changing the flow of traffic.

Josh: 2:16

Right? Right. We're we have we have impacted our local community in in such a remarkable way.

Pamela: 2:24

What else can we change?

Josh: 2:25

I mean there's probably things. there's probably things that annoy us so we could talk about them.

Pamela: 2:30

Oh so much construction. Listen.

Josh: 2:32

Oh my god.

Pamela: 2:33

Right?

Josh: 2:34

I I have construction on three sides of my house right now. There are three like there of the major roads that are around us of the four major roads three of them have active construction on them right now. And I mean okay cool and thank you. And also

Pamela: 2:51

Uh-huh

Josh: 2:51

Can we do one at a time?

Pamela: 2:53

Right.

Josh: 2:54

Can we just can can we do enough planning to where we aren't shutting down major thoroughfares all in one area?

Pamela: 3:00

This summer was so bad. And I'm glad they do it during the summer because you know school traffic and all of that like I get it but yeah my GPS was like I don't like my GPS was like figure it out.

Josh: 3:15

Right.

Pamela: 3:15

Like it was like I can't like you're I'm telling you to go this way you're saying you can't go that way go this other way. It's like well that way's blocked two. And it's just like well I guess you're just gonna have to go around the city to wherever it is you need to be.

Josh: 3:28

Right. Yeah. And and unfortunately there's no end in sight. Like the even the smaller projects there there's a a street right over by my kids' school that has been torn up. I mean for months really. It actually started before the end of their last school year. And I just don't see it getting any better. It's uh I you know I don't I'm not trying to be critical but what are y'all doing? Like like literally literally what are you doing?

Pamela: 3:53

Okay so last year there was a street that it they were redoing an intersection because there's train tracks. So there's an intersection there's train tracks and then they were creating like I guess a light on the other side. That construction project went on the entire school year last year. Okay. It finally opened right before school started. And I was like awesome because it is a way for me to get quickly from one kid's school to the next.

Josh: 4:21

Yeah.

Pamela: 4:22

Just in time for them to then do construction on a different part of the same street and block it again.

Josh: 4:29

Right.

Pamela: 4:30

Like son of a

Josh: 4:32

Yeah it's it is never ending. I appreciate the fact that infrastructure improvements are being made. Please keep doing that. I just am requesting a smidge more strategy around it. And and if we could I don't know maybe let the public know when something is about to happen in a way that's effective. Not just like okay I know that people are gonna be like well but maybe they talk about it at council meetings. No one goes to that. No one's watching a city council meeting to know what the construction schedules are. Like if there's like can we just what could it just be an email? Can they just email us out? Be like heads up.

Pamela: 5:05

Can it literally just be Sharpie on paper that says hey this road's gonna be like a freaking like yard sale sign?

Josh: 5:11

Right.

Pamela: 5:11

That just says hey this road's gonna be closed.

Josh: 5:13

Right.

Pamela: 5:14

That costs none dollars.

Josh: 5:16

Right. Yeah. Yeah. See once again we're changing municipal policy. We are gonna see in the near future like a garage sale sign with garage sales scratched out and there's gonna be like construction starting.

Pamela: 5:29

Yeah but I'm hoping that or maybe we need signs that say construction ending.

Josh: 5:34

Oh god that would be amazing.

Pamela: 5:36

Like hey this road that you use for years that's been closed for the last 10 months is opening soon. Like that'd be great.

Josh: 5:44

Yeah it really does.

Pamela: 5:46

No so the other day my son or my husband was taking my son to school and so my husband puts in the GPS because he's gotta go like on the other side of the city. And so he's he puts the GPS in and my son looks at it and he goes He goes 'Is that how long you're gonna be on the road?' He's like 'Yeah' he's like 'Yeah that's my typical drive time'. And he goes 'That sucks'. And he's like 'Yeah it does'. Now mind you my son is eight.

Josh: 6:22

Right.

Pamela: 6:23

Okay. And we we don't condone those words outside of the four walls of our home.

Josh: 6:29

Yes.

Pamela: 6:29

So we have we have within the confines of our abode we have words that you can use but yeah you don't use those words outside. I guess the car is an exception.

Josh: 6:45

Yeah it's an extension of the home. So I'm curious like when you were growing up.

Pamela: 6:50

Oh hell no. I probably couldn't even say oh hell no.

Josh: 6:54

Yeah. Yeah.

Pamela: 6:54

Like

Josh: 6:55

Same.

Pamela: 6:56

And I didn't grow up in a hyper religious you know home but uh I well I guess when I was a teenager I started to kind of push the boundaries a little bit and my parents didn't push back too hard. but that was also you know 16 17 18.

Josh: 7:16

Right. Yeah.

Pamela: 7:16

These have been rules for my kids since day one because um my one of my daughter's first words was the F-word.

Josh: 7:25

Oh no.

Pamela: 7:27

And that's when I was like okay how do I want to tackle this as a millennial xennial mom? I was like yeah we just keep those words at home.

Josh: 7:36

Yeah. And that's that's basically and you you can judge uh listeners you can judge my parenting all you want. Here but the we have a similar set of rules and the language that I use with our kids is like okay these are okay sometimes words. We're gonna call them sometimes words. Like I don't want it to be the only thing ever coming out of your mouth but also within the confines of our home like

Pamela: 8:03

and context.

Josh: 8:04

Yeah and context yeah. And in fact there have been times where I've laughed so hard at my kid trying to use a grown-up word and using it incorrectly in a way that's so much funnier than it would have been if they'd used it correctly like they're trying it out a little bit and and the first few times it just doesn't really land and it's so so hilarious. Like I love it. But you know for me growing up I was in a similar situation as you. I was very restricted as far as what I could say I was also restricted as far as what I could watch and things like that. Like if TV shows and movies had uh too much vulgarity in them by the ever-changing standard of my parents that was that was something that would get shut down. And so I grew up in an environment where I just had to really be cautious about any of that. And I I really didn't use a whole lot of language until I was much older and and living by myself and I was like oh I can say whatever I want now that's kind of nice. But it at this point like as a parent I try especially earlier on in my kids' lives I tried pretty hard to keep things more or less under control um with whatever came out of my mouth. But as I've gotten older it you know for me anyway I've sort of relaxed my own intensity around what my kids hear. There was a point at which I w this was not that long ago. I was driving and you know I hit some unexpected traffic and the kids were in the car with me. And a guy was trying to jump across multiple lanes to to get to an exit that he was about to miss. And it's pretty bumper to bumper at this point and he's he's really just squeezing his vehicle into spaces that were not a good idea and he jumped right in front of me and and missed my bumper by just inches. And so I jump on my brakes and I I almost said something vulgar. And I kind of stopped myself down and and pivoted to a different word relatively quickly but in a way that was pretty obvious to my kids. And my nine-year-old daughter goes 'Dad it's okay you can say it'.

Pamela: 10:23

Thanks for your permission.

Josh: 10:25

Right. And and I couldn't decide it in that moment if that was a relief for her to say that or if or if I felt like it was an audit of my parenting like man she knows what's she knows exactly what I didn't say. So she's giving me that permission to be like you don't have to censor but

Pamela: 10:46

See my favorite was when our kids were little and they would say things like adult it wasn't even necessarily like like curse words or whatever. But that when they would just say adult things in context that were just hilarious like so my daughter's first curse word was the F-word because um I subscribe to road rage. when it's especially back then it was very stressful when they were little. And um I remember being up behind this guy and he didn't he just turns no brake lights no light no nothing. so I said 'nice effing brake lights' um to which then she made it a song 'Effin brake lights Effin brake lights.' And I was like mmm and and then I was like 'Dammit' and she's like 'Dammit'. And I was like ah and then it's vicious cycle.

Josh: 11:48

Yes yeah. It's you really are told a lot when you're a young parent like oh your kid hears everything your kid hears everything. And for me I I believed it because I have so many siblings and so I had seen that at work in my own lived experience. But it hits different when it's your kids and and then you're trying to censor yourself to some degree because you don't want to overly expose them to language before whatever but then you figure out really quickly that all your efforts are are for nothing like they're they're paying attention to so much of what you're saying.

Pamela: 12:23

See that's cute because I was the opposite. Everybody thought that Josh was gonna be the one that our kids were gonna be learning vulgar language from. No it was definitely me. I definitely did not censor myself like I don't know like I didn't really grow up in a strict household but every now and then things I think there were just some kind of unsaid rules.

Josh: 12:46

Yeah

Pamela: 12:46

But the one that always got to me. So we didn't we didn't have cable when I was growing up but we had satellite. Now satellite our satellite though only had like 30 channels okay and one of those channels was HBO. So I was um exposed to HBO and its content very early. But then in like middle school South Park came out.

Josh: 13:16

Oh wow yeah.

Pamela: 13:17

And my parents absolutely would not let me watch South Park. And I'm sitting there going I watched Milk Money when I was like eight. And now that I'm like a teenager I can't watch South Park.

Josh: 13:31

Right. Yeah that makes sense.

Pamela: 13:34

But I mean I did follow that rule. because I would even go to friends' houses who could watch South Park. Yeah and they knew I couldn't watch it so they we wouldn't watch it.

Josh: 13:44

Yeah see I I had a different experience in that. I would go to friends' houses. So mine the the show I really wanted to watch when I was a kid was The Simpsons and that was flat outlawed in my house. Like I was not allowed but I totally got into the humor of it like that style of humor especially that phase of my life was of a huge appeal. So I would go over to friends' houses and watch I mean as much Simpsons as was on TV because this was way before the days of streaming. It's and I loved getting to catch up on some of that stuff. I wonder if my parents know this but the

Pamela: 14:19

Well they do now.

Josh: 14:20

Yeah they're about to. One of the houses that uh I went to and could watch The Simpsons was actually my cousin's house. My my dad's twin brother and my dad's twin brother my uncle uh apparently just wasn't all that bothered by The Simpsons. And so I would watch it with my older cousins.

Pamela: 14:35

Yeah I mean I grew up with The Simpsons. I always loved the Halloween episodes but it was just so weird to me that like they drew the line at South Park. I was like ohkay.

Josh: 14:45

That's a weird line to draw. Yeah yeah. Well I mean thankfully we turned out brilliantly. Like all that censorship really made a difference. Yeah.

Pamela: 14:57

Oh man.

Josh: 14:59

But you know it what's fun though is now we get to make different decisions with our kids. And you know there's some stuff that our kids are really into that that I think is really funny. That's one of the great parts about being a parent in this generation is that the TV shows and movies that our kids are really into have stuff baked into it for the grown-ups. And so like my son right now is in this huge Teen Titans Go phase. And so I'll walk past the TV and and catch just like a snippet of it and it makes me laugh because it's clever humor.

Pamela: 15:28

Yeah.

Josh: 15:29

Like that and Gravity Falls and and

Pamela: 15:31

At least we know that their humor is gonna be on point.

Josh: 15:33

Yes exactly. And

Pamela: 15:35

If we've done nothing else

Josh: 15:36

yes yeah we have made our kids funny. Yeah will they be able to function? 

Pamela: 15:40

We have nailed the dry humor.

Josh: 15:41

Right. Can they function in common society? I have no idea but they're funny and so that's endearing. and thankfully both our two kids and y'all's two kids are both funny in their way they're all funny in their own ways.

Pamela: 15:53

They absolutely my daughter though it's interesting. She she's very type A she's she's a rule follower. she used to get on my case about my language. You know I would be always be the one saying you know it's okay you know if you let one slip if you you know fall or whatever. And then she's like Mom can you just like not? Can you just like chill out?

Josh: 16:20

Yeah. Well and I I'm sure that I'm sure my son did similar things to me. I I have vague memories of that uh in the times where he was much younger and I would say something a little more colorful. He would be like Dad that's not appropriate. Be like shut up. You're grounded. You don't tell me what to do.

Pamela: 16:43

You shut your mouth.

Josh: 16:46

I just I I want I want a different experience for my kids than what I had too. I want them to feel like they could be a little bit expressive and they can be funny and and you know if funny means dropping a cuss word for the shock value of it all then I'm kind of here for it. And at this point too like all of our kids are old enough my kids and yours are old enough to where we can just get away with a lot more. Oh man. So one night so over the summer my family spent a lot of time at Pamela and Josh's family's house because they have a great pool in their backyard. So so we would go over um on the weekends and go swimming.

Pamela: 17:24

People usually just use us for our pool.

Josh: 17:27

Yeah it's your only redeeming quality.

Pamela: 17:30

Well yeah that's fair.

Josh: 17:31

But we we would go over there and be there all the time. There was one night where we we we had swam a bunch and and had some dinner or whatever and there's this wonderful game on Nintendo Switch called Jackbox.

Pamela: 17:44

We've talked about it.

Josh: 17:46

We have talked about it and and we learned the hard way. The first time we played Jackbox with our kids we learned the hard way that there is a family-friendly setting that we had not checked. And we we dive into this game and we're all it's it's all eight of us. It's you your husband your two kids me my wife our two kids and we're all playing together. And I'm not gonna say what the prompt was. I remember what it was.

Pamela: 18:15

Oh but but here's the thing too is that everybody gets a different prompt and you don't know what everyone's prompt is.

Josh: 18:21

Yes okay.

Pamela: 18:22

So there it's kind of one of this these like you don't know what the kids like what prompt. Yeah. Yeah.

Josh: 18:28

So for the uninitiated for those who haven't played Jackbox and who didn't catch us talking about it on a previous episode the premise of the game is that it runs off the Nintendo Switch but all the players of the game use personal devices to play the game. So you use your your iPad or cell phone to as your device to play. And it gives you text prompts and you use your device to answer these text prompts. And it's really really funny. It's really entertaining. It's a wonderful group game. And we we had a blast playing it with the kids but that very first time out of the gate we got to one prompt and the a lot of the kids had already seen that prompt pop up on their devices but they didn't know what it meant. And so it was a it was an inappropriate very adult-centered prompt and thank God none of our kids knew what it was.

Pamela: 19:20

So we are doing something right.

Josh: 19:22

Right.

Pamela: 19:23

We have gotten that thing right.

Josh: 19:24

Yeah we we did verify that they had not had exposure to some things I really don't want them to have exposure to yet. But it was a really funny moment and when we all figured out that the kids had seen this prompt before we even knew about it we then immediately paused the game and dove into the settings and found the family friendly setting and engaged it. because like we just didn't know. I didn't know. We didn't know.

Pamela: 19:48

Oh no nobody knew. I didn't. I mean we played it many times before. I didn't know that there was a a certain setting.

Josh: 19:55

Yeah but it was a blast of a time. And and it is a fun time to be a parent it's a fun time. Time to it with the ages that our kids are and kind of in the world that we live in the world's heavy and it's hard and there's lots of ridiculous and and uh depressing things going on on the regular. But our kids make us laugh and I'm so grateful for that. And you know if that means that they're gonna sling a cuss word at us every now and again you know in an effort to make a punchline I'm here for it. It doesn't bother me in the slightest. And I just think there's so many bigger fish to fry from a parenting standpoint and I don't need that to be something that we're gonna create conflict around. yeah I I enjoy um all of the the parenting eras I've been in and and I they they're hard in their own ways but they're also hilarious in their own ways and it leaves me in a place where I'm always looking forward to what's next.

Pamela: 20:48

Oh yeah.

Josh: 20:49

And that's that's a pretty cool place to be.

Pamela: 20:50

Yeah.

Josh: 20:51

So I read an article this week that I'm pretty excited about. So we talk all the time about how we're parents and we've gone through all sorts of seasons with our kids and thankfully both of our families are now in seasons where we're not nearly as reliant as we used to be on childcare. And the state of New Mexico is the first state in the United States to pass a universal child care program within their state. They already had subsidized childcare available for families under a certain like income level. But now they've just decided to expand the program and make it free for all families. And man do I wish that had existed when my kids were young. I I mean that that's

Pamela: 21:34

I mean I mean it's 2025.

Josh: 21:37

Right.

Pamela: 21:38

Like and we are just now at this point like I it's brilliant.

Josh: 21:44

Yes.

Pamela: 21:44

and I hope that it is successful and becomes adopted throughout.

Josh: 21:51

Absolutely.

Pamela: 21:52

You know but yeah it's kind of ridiculous that it's like only one state is really kind of kind of doing this but but go on.

Josh: 22:01

I love that there's more and more states that are turning their attention towards what the needs of their actual population is. Like they are taking it upon themselves to do more for those families including like the state of Minnesota. They're offering free lunches uh breakfast and lunch I believe for every kid that attends a Minnesota public school. That's genius. That's that's a wonderful use of tax dollars.

Pamela: 22:24

Yes.

Josh: 22:25

And and for New Mexico to be setting an example like this they're definitely going to figure some things out the hard way. I'm sure that this isn't going to be a perfect rollout especially because they're wanting to roll this out on November 1st of this year which is quick.

Pamela: 22:40

Yes.

Josh: 22:40

But they're there it looks like based on the article that's in front of me it looks like that they're leveraging their existing program that was taking care of families under a certain income level and they're just expanding it all the way up. So it's this is pretty encouraging and I'm a tiny bit jealous.

Pamela: 22:57

Right yeah right. Oh my gosh the amount of money that we spent. So yeah even in Kentucky which isn't a major market one of the reasons why our children are four years apart and I even wanted to stretch it to five years apart because I really wanted to not have to pay dual child care. Yeah because infants are ridiculously expensive. and then you know you have a second child and what used to crack me up like they'd be like Oh yeah a second child you get 10% off. And I'm like okay I save a hundred bucks a month but I'm paying more than my mortgage for child care. So it's like I have a mortgage payment I have a second mortgage payment. We have two full-time um parents you know income. and it was tight. It was tight for a long time. I mean it was I I just I don't see how people could do it. And I would have probably loved to have had a few more kids but honestly it was the child care. And I never really understood that. I always remember thinking like everybody's like oh kids are so expensive kids are so expensive. And then I'm like we had them and I'm like well diapers really I mean they're not that bad. Yeah. You know I I was lucky or fortunate enough to be able to breastfeed for several months before we did the formula thing. Formula um is not cheap. but at the same time I'm still kind of thinking like okay it was the child care.

Josh: 24:23

Yes.

Pamela: 24:24

The child care is what does you in. and the fact that it has never been subsidized. Right. and I I just I really honestly have never understood how single parents do it.

Josh: 24:36

Oh man I have said that a million times. Yes.

Pamela: 24:39

I I I I don't I don't I mean if especially if you don't have family or any of that like I don't I don't understand. I don't understand how they've made it.

Josh: 24:49

Yeah.

Pamela: 24:49

And then and then to layer on top of that you know the economy and then this whole pull yourself by your pull yourself up by your bootstraps mentality. And I'm just like it just must be nice to not ever have to worry about those things. But I'm really really glad that they are doing something that is really really gonna benefit honestly society as a whole.

Josh: 25:15

Yes. Yeah. And and I'm hoping that this ends up being sort of a testing ground for this model that other states can look to and be like okay we see where they got it right we see where they needed to make some adjustments and now we're gonna implement our own you know version of this in a way that is really going to you know impact our population. And the for us when we had kids we did the math and pretty quickly figured out that we could scale back in some other areas have Krista leave her job and we would come out about the same place financially on one income on just my income with her staying at home with a newborn. Because like the article that I was reading about this whole New Mexico program said that the average cost of infant childcare nationwide is over twelve hundred dollars a month. That's one kid that's one infant. So if you have an infant

Pamela: 26:07

and that's honestly less than what we paid.

Josh: 26:10

It's less than what we it's less than what we were quoted to. We never actually had infants in childcare because Krista she did step away from her job and and she did the full-time mom thing for a little while and she was excellent at it which surprises no one. But but she uh you know she from the start of our marriage she talked about how it was a priority to her that she wanted to work she wanted to contribute financially in that way. That was always important. And so for her to step away was a little bit of a culture shift for us but the math just worked out to where it was like well why are we why would we shell out a huge percentage of your income to childcare when you can be home and we we're not spending that money and we can guarantee that the level of care our kid is getting is up to scratch you know? Because that's the other part of it too is like if I'm gonna pay $1400 a month plus to put my infant in childcare I need to have a high amount of trust in the person I'm handing this infant to. And even that is extremely nervous. Oh yes. Like and we were fortunate enough to have our kids in some programs where I did know some of these people and I did trust them and I felt good about who I was leaving my kids with. But man most people don't have that luxury of having a little bit of relationship with the people that you're handing off your kid to and that's stressful all by itself. I mean

Pamela: 27:34

Well and so when we had my daughter for the first 18 months um we we were both working full-time um but she would get passed between grandparents um throughout the week which yes is nice but also has its drawbacks. you know if someone wants to go out of town well we gotta figure we gotta readjust and or someone gets ill or the baby gets ill like now we don't want certain people you know being exposed to certain things. So it it kind of creates its own um complexity.

Josh: 28:09

Yeah.

Pamela: 28:10

However if we had had the option of free childcare like it just would have made life so much easier during that time. because we were pretty much just trying to avoid having to pay

Josh: 28:25

Right.

Pamela: 28:25

for it. and yes we were fortunate enough to have family members who were available and willing to help. But once we got the children into daycare and it created that routine and that habit like things were just so much smoother after that. and it gave me an opportunity um because I had a job where we would get Friday afternoons off.

Josh: 28:52

Nice.

Pamela: 28:53

So we had longer days Monday through Friday or Monday through Thursday and then we were out by noon. And I was able to do what I wanted for a couple of hours which is a as a working parent.

Josh: 29:06

Oh that's a godsend.

Pamela: 29:08

Yes. Yeah. you know I I would kind of end up spending that time doing you know errands and grocery but there were times it's like you know what? No I'm going to get like a manicure pedicure I'm doing some some self-care you know during that time. but you know we were paying handsomely for that. and it also didn't make sense for me to pick the kids up early because we were still paying for that time.

Josh: 29:36

Right. If it's not changing what you're paying then why pick them up?

Pamela: 29:38

Exactly.

Josh: 29:39

We so really up until just a few years ago we had our kids in some after-school care on and off. So thankfully we live in a school district that offers a very simple and pretty well done uh after school care program. And so our kids were in that really up until let's see the end of my oldest uh let's see he would have been when he finished fourth grade is when we stopped. Because they had gotten old enough to the point where you know they they could be home for a little bit on their own. It wasn't a huge deal anymore. And we've also got the advantage both of our families really have the advantage of having pretty mature older kids. And so them being by themselves for some stretch of time is not that big of a deal. So even the after-school program it was really affordable but we were still paying about $700 a month for both of them to be in it which is not all that bad. And yet that's higher than my first three car payments.

Pamela: 30:40

Oh yeah. I remember when when my daughter got into kindergarten it was literally a pay raise. Yeah exactly. It was like whoa we could buy a car. Right. We could buy three cars. Like and then once my son was out I was like wow like it was it was all that money. And and to look back and if we had had this universal childcare um what we could have put back.

Josh: 31:09

Oh yeah yeah.

Pamela: 31:10

what you know like college funds or or just you know being able to do other things with that. I mean we had so much house maintenance and things that we were putting off because we were like we just don't have the extra cash um because we're paying two mortgages. and that's a lot. And again it goes back to I just don't understand how single parents are are doing it. I mean

Josh: 31:35

Bless them.

Pamela: 31:36

without without these pro you know without these programs already. yeah.

Josh: 31:41

Well for as much as we've complained about you know the federal government policy and you know how frustrated we've been with our current administration and all of that it's nice to have something that is sort of politically adjacent that is also something to celebrate.

Pamela: 31:58

And well because it's it's what I personally believe government is for.

Josh: 32:04

Right.

Pamela: 32:04

It is for people it is to help people. Like I am more than happy for my tax dollars to pay for students to eat. Oh one million percent. To pay for child care so that way parents can go to work and do what they need to do. Like I just I'm okay with my tax dollars going to that. I am not okay with tax dollars going to a lot of things that it is going toward right now.

Josh: 32:30

Yeah like potentially another foreign war. But I I'm 100% with you. If if my taxes need to go up $10 a year or $20 a year and that's feeding hundreds of thousands of kids that might otherwise not be fed then take my money. Like I just and I it's not like I have a lot of money sitting around to spare but uh that yes I will contribute to that program because you can't educate a hungry person for starters.

Pamela: 33:00

Yes I feel very strongly about this because last year and earlier this year I volunteered with an organization here in North Texas where all I did was deliver snacks to schools who had underserved students. And I as I did it like originally I just kind of volunteered and then I the more I kind of got to know these people that I would see on like a weekly basis or every other week. and I would the the counselors are who I would give these to. And essentially whenever they had students that were like sent to the office or who were just causing problems like these snacks just went because most of these kids were just hungry.

Josh: 33:47

Right.

Pamela: 33:47

Which made them hangry which I absolutely identify with.

Josh: 33:50

Exactly.

Pamela: 33:51

But I was like that makes a lot of sense. And we would we would send home um or they would send home these students home with with meals for the weekends so that way they would have food. and this was all a nonprofit organization. and there were times even that the community would get together and do GoFundMe's to pay off students' lunch debt. And I'm like great yes awesome. Like yes like but this is like why are individuals in in private organizations taking on this burden and this responsibility when it like this is a drop in the bucket of the federal budget?

Josh: 34:37

Yeah.

Pamela: 34:38

Like this is what I feel government is for is for helping people you know making sure people are fed that their basic needs are taken care of um not legislating our bodies and and and coming up with just ridiculous bills and legislation to force the Ten Commandments in in classrooms like none of this makes sense.

Josh: 35:04

Right. I'd love to know what they're spending on getting the Ten Commandments in these classrooms.

Pamela: 35:08

I they they couldn't I'm sorry. I'm passionate. They could take that money and feed these children.

Josh: 35:14

Right yeah. What if we just fed them? You know what Jesus did? He fed people. Yeah. So I I a huge tip of the hat to the state of New Mexico for just being willing to be a guinea pig. And I'm sure this isn't gonna go perfectly but the fact that they're trying to is huge.

Pamela: 35:33

Well and it sounds like they have already kind of tested this at least you know like with that poverty that poverty line. So I mean obviously something worked. Right. and so now they they see that they can now extrapolate that across the state. And I'm very very anxious to see other states adopt it. Ideally I would love it to be federally adopted but I don't have a lot of faith in that right now. but I do hope that more um states start putting their budget dollars into more programs like this.

Josh: 36:07

Yeah I completely agree. So best of luck to the state of New Mexico. You uh you have my attention. Yep. And I hope this goes brilliantly. We've got something really cool coming up this weekend and I know you're excited about it. Tell us what is happening in Dallas in September this weekend.

Pamela: 36:26

So this weekend in Dallas is the Pride Parade.

Josh: 36:29

Yeah.

Pamela: 36:30

So um and I did not know how much I loved Pride until I actually went to my first event. And I'll be honest you know I I had I was not far removed from you know the Baptist church and and evangelical Christianity. and so I was to me it was just it was I was very much in the camp of I'm not judging like LGBTQ or these lifestyles or anything. but to me it was just a community that was theirs and and like I just that like I didn't need to participate in because that like I I would yeah but I just you know to me it was just their community and and and all of that. And um so yeah I'm very much looking forward to it. We've got our shirts I've got my earrings. and I'm I'm excited.

Josh: 37:36

Both you and I spent some time in pretty conservative evangelical circles and we're pretty removed from anything pride related. What was the turning point for you where you were like oh this is something I want to engage with?

Pamela: 37:51

Absolutely. Jen Hatmaker.

Josh: 37:54

She keeps turning up.

Pamela: 37:55

She does. She does. So she had brought onto her podcast a lady named Sarah Cunningham. you can go back and listen it should still be available. but she had a similar upbringing where you know her family they were were evangelical Christians they raised their family in evangelical Christianity and then her son came out as gay. And she she admits she did not handle it well. and they struggled and and you know she can she tells her whole story but in the end um she learned to accept um that that is who he was and so she created an organization called Free Mom Hugs.

Josh: 38:50

For those of you who are not watching on YouTube Pamela is wearing a free mom hugs t-shirt.

Pamela: 38:55

Yes. So um in 2018 I decided that I was going to go to the Pride Parade in Louisville and I had no idea what to expect. but I was like you know what? I want to do this because I was inspired by Sarah's story and this organization. And there was like a group. So I did manage to find a group on Facebook. of it it wasn't a part of the Sarah's organization. It was it was just kind of a hey we're gonna get together and do this. so I got the shirt and I went down there and I met up with the group and um oh my god it was so much fun. Like it was so much fun. Everyone was just so joyful

Josh: 39:44

Yeah.

Pamela: 39:45

And excited and it was it was loud and it was music. I mean it was a parade and and it was colorful and just you know we're standing there on the sidelines. with our our free mom hug shirts and I'll say I walked away with so much more glitter than I than I showed up with um and a roller coaster of emotions you know yes everyone there was just you know celebrating and and it was and it was a blast but I cannot tell you how many kids teenagers college students adults came up to me hugging like they would find me they would come and I target like I was like and I'm the type of person listen I'm not a hugger okay so this was kind of a big deal for me

Josh: 40:46

Yeah.

Pamela: 40:47

I am not I'm not super affectionate I'm I'm not a hugger but I tell you when I made eye contact with these people I'm like bring it in um and you know they would share their stories of like I haven't talked to my mom in 20 years like uh as soon as I came out like I was shunned um you know I've been homeless since I was a kid you know and and and all of these stories and it's just it's heartbreaking and I mean these people are just crying

Josh: 41:17

Yeah.

Pamela: 41:18

I mean I had probably just as many tears as I did specks of glitter like it it was just so heartbreaking and emotional again this goes back to the whole like these are people

Josh: 41:31

Yeah.

Pamela: 41:32

These are human beings like I I just don't understand I don't understand the hate I don't understand the legislation I don't understand the ideology and the like how every how the how we can outcast

Josh: 41:56

Right.

Pamela: 41:57

People just for who they love

Josh: 41:59

Right.

Pamela: 41:59

Or or how they were made like I yeah

Josh: 42:04

Also on top of all that the gays make everything better they make everything better

Pamela: 42:10

Oh my gosh so yes so I I went to the Pride Parade I had a blast we had a festival so I think I think there's Pride Festival in June and then there's a parade in September. Yeah um and so I had missed the festival that year but um I I went to a drag brunch after that um so Louisville has uh it's a steakhouse but on on the weekends they do a drag brunch yeah oh my god it is so much fun and now I I'll admit I was intimidated mainly because I was like am I gonna like be in the spotlight like I am I gonna get picked on am I you know no uh uh because I wasn't an older white gentleman.

Josh: 42:58

Right.

Pamela: 42:58

Man they target older white gentlemen but they were loving it

Josh: 43:04

Yeah.

Pamela: 43:05

They were it was so much fun and I I just I don't understand like my when people are start talking against pride and and all these I'm like you have never been to a drag show have you because I don't know anything more fun.

Josh: 43:21

Yeah.

Pamela: 43:21

I mean it's it's adult entertainment the humor is amazing and so one of the one of the favorite things that my husband and I like to do um when we have a babysitter we don't have kids we'll go to a gay bar.

Josh: 43:36

Yeah.

Pamela: 43:36

Gay bars are amazing because people are gonna leave you alone.

Josh: 43:41

Yeah.

Pamela: 43:41

You know you the music is amazing yeah like you you just you go out and you just dance and you just have fun and like everybody's just joyful and in a good mood and um you know they'll we we've been to S4 where they have the the rose room with the drag show like in the evening and it's just so funny and and it is the one place I am not uncomfortable.

Josh: 44:05

Right. Yeah.

Pamela: 44:06

I mean I will I've been to to bars and pubs and and things back home and I'm like I you get rubbed up on and touched and flirted with and and all of these things that I'm I I am so much more uncomfortable yeah in that situation than I than I have ever been in a gay bar. And and I just I love it.

Josh: 44:30

It's a lot of fun I so the coming up this weekend is the the Dallas Pride parade and my wife drives a Jeep and that is a beloved vehicle among the LGBT community and um we have some dear friends I'm gonna shamelessly plug so um my friends Justin and Patrick started an organization several years ago called LGBTQ outdoors and the whole premise behind it is the the outdoor spaces in many ways have been co-opted by sort of a hyper conservative hyper masculine archetype and and it's hard for people within that LGBTQ plus community to feel comfortable getting back out into those spaces because you never really know what you're gonna end up running into and and where you're gonna be welcome and where you're not. And so Justin and Patrick both have a a passion for the outdoors they're both hunters are both um you know experienced in all sorts of different activities and so they decided to start this organization and it has been really transformative within that community and they've gotten tons of awesome attention. That's awesome. And they do um they do these trips that I'm annoyed that I can't go on. I am in fact a straight man and therefore I I am not I'm not uh they're not for me but at the same time I love that they're happening because like they just got back from Alaska and the photos I saw are unbelievable. And so they are using my wife's Jeep to tow a trailer as a float in the parade. So they're decorating this trailer and and they've got a whole bunch of stuff they're planning on setting up and they wanted to use her jeep. And so my wife the moment she heard about this was like absolutely and so and a little sidebar my wife at any given point has like nine gay boyfriends. Like she loves a gay boyfriend.

Pamela: 46:30

Oh I want a gay bestie.

Josh: 46:32

Oh man that she I'm sure that you could borrow one of hers.

Pamela: 46:36

Oh my gosh they are just yeah fabulous.

Josh: 46:38

Yeah um but Justin and Patrick are are dear dear friends of ours we actually sang in their wedding um and they were one of the first same-sex couples that I knew who got married after it became federally legal um but I've known them for years and years and years and they're both like brothers to me. And in fact they would be really wonderful podcast guests now that I'm sitting here thinking about it. We need to add them to the the list but they um they're excited to to be out there and celebrating Krista's extremely excited to be out there and be helpful and yeah I unfortunately I personally can't make it because of some other professional commitments but uh I'm

Pamela: 47:15

You're missing out.

Josh: 47:16

Oh I I'm I'm 100% missing out.

Pamela: 47:18

You are so uh you are gonna have all the FOMO.

Josh: 47:21

I am yeah yeah and

Pamela: 47:22

I'm sorry

Josh: 47:23

and it's okay it's uh it's my own fault I decided to go and make money um instead of be out there I know it's a lame reason but I'm I'm really excited for for all that to happen and really like my own path to my own path out of a lot of the more evangelical perspective of the LGBTQ community it followed in some ways a similar trajectory to yours in that I I had to be sort of exposed to that community and then once I was actually around a lot of the non-hetero people I was like oh my god y'all are awesome.

Pamela: 47:59

Yeah I I love all of you this is so great like and which is why like I just I struggle so much like this should not be a political conversation I don't feel like it's a political conversation like we're may we're able to talk about it outside but there's nothing here that sh that needs to be legislated.

Josh: 48:20

Right.

Pamela: 48:20

They are not hurting anyone like

Josh: 48:23

They're helping

Pamela: 48:24

And my thing is like for the people who s who just don't you know I'm like just go go to a drag brunch they will leave you alone like they they they can tell um but just go and have fun and and realize like you are afraid when it comes down to it you're afraid of something you just don't understand that you have been told about is something that it's not yeah.

Josh: 48:49

Well and the church is really good at that too the the the church specifically is really good at making something all about sex and then making you feel bad.

Pamela: 48:57

They demonize it.

Josh: 48:58

Yeah and it's I just don't it's very frustrating when I start to think about uh how wrong I had it for so many years. And and you know when I look at

Pamela: 49:09

The amount of gay boyfriends I've missed out on.

Josh: 49:12

Yeah I I I am certain that that there you had plenty of opportunities and I'm certain that Krista will let you borrow a couple of hers. But it's it's fun to be on the other side of that.

Pamela: 49:26

It's fun to be able to come along and s alongside and support that community and to be a straight ally which I am and I'm almost to a point where like I don't if you haven't been to an event if you don't have friends in the community if you haven't explored it or looked outside of what you've been told I kind of don't want to hear your opinion on on any sort of political legislation around it because uh you are damaging wonderful people for no reason whatsoever.

Josh: 50:03

Yeah.

Pamela: 50:04

Yeah so

Josh: 50:05

What are you gonna wear to the parade on Saturday?

Pamela: 50:07

I'm so excited. Okay so I got my earrings

Josh: 50:09

Yeah

Pamela: 50:10

I've got a rainbow colored shirt um I'm gonna have my jean shorts I've got rainbow colored fishnets um and my knee high uh Chuck Taylors.

Josh: 50:25

Oh nice yeah

Pamela: 50:26

Yeah and then um my daughter uh ordered a tie-dye shirt with a butterfly um because that's appropriate um and yeah like they're looking forward to it like we're we're this is the first event like this that we will be bringing the kids along to

Josh: 50:47

Nice.

Pamela: 50:48

Or along with us and they're looking forward to it I'm looking forward to it um I am anticipating questions oh yeah I and I'm here for it like I I want them to not be afraid of this community or or I want them to experience it and come up with their own opinions. you know because I when I think about my kids and I think about the LGBTQ community I think back to when I was their age and what exposure did I have to to that community and honestly a lot of it was TV. Yeah um and I just remember RuPaul yeah and like asking my mom about RuPaul and like when she told me he was a man for the first time and I was like what?

Josh: 51:38

Yeah.

Pamela: 51:38

And I was so like blown away by that but she didn't demonize it. The Birdcage.

Josh: 51:46

Oh I love that movie

Pamela: 51:48

Amazing I still take Pirin tablets um from that movie it and my parents loved that movie like it it was it was never demonized.

Josh: 52:01

It's a great movie.

Pamela: 52:02

And it's just so wild because I didn't it I didn't start to kind of question that community until I got older and was actually going to church to where I was like wait a minute like in the in the whole talk of sin and things kind of going on around that I still even then had trouble reconciling.

Josh: 52:21

Yeah

Pamela: 52:22

A lot of that thought process and that that kind of legalistic um demonizing of that community um because I'm like it it's so counterintuitive yeah to uh the teaching of Jesus right in Christianity in the in the the New Testament I I just could never reconcile outcasting and and a phrase that I held on to for a long time until I realized how damaging it was was love the sinner hate the sin. And I thought as long as I love the sinner and hate the sin like okay like I'm on the right side of of God.

Josh: 53:13

Right right

Pamela: 53:15

I'm gonna make it into heaven because you know I believe this and and I'm like wait a minute that's BS yeah.

Josh: 53:23

Yeah and especially when you're talking about like in that phrase what you're doing is you're saying the sin is this fundamental part of who you are and what what people can't reconcile in a lot of ways is like you you can't separate you know who someone loves from who they are fundamentally you know and

Pamela: 53:45

And the picking and choosing yeah of the sin. Like I I it the hypocrisy of it. Like I understand that some people don't like it. They don't agree with it. Okay. I don't agree with people smoking. Like I don't agree with other vices and things that people have but I don't think that they shouldn't go to church for those things. I don't think that they shouldn't be Christians. I don't think that they should change

Josh: 54:14

Yeah well the good news is there's gonna be one heck of a celebration happening over the course of this weekend.

Pamela: 54:21

I'm so excited!

Josh: 54:21

And it's gonna be a tremendous amount of fun and if you live in North Texas and you haven't stopped by S4 or Roundup or one of these other spaces like I think you will be surprised at what those spaces are and and how safe you will feel there. Because man it's just a load of fun and I I really hope that this weekend is just a blast for all parties. Our kids are going they're excited our daughters have coordinated outfits.

Pamela: 54:48

Oh I know

Josh: 54:50

I was sent links I was sent Amazon links from my daughter based on what your daughter bought so they can be kind of in the same vibe which I thought was cute and fun. And this is not our kids' first Pride event they've been to a couple of the ones that are at Fair Park but they've never been to the parade. Okay so that will be a first um but yeah they're they're pumped and you know I I I have nothing but support for all of it and you know honestly I've I kind of considered canceling some of my plans to try and be out there but it it was too little too late by the time all of that started to come together. But I'm excited for y'all to

Pamela: 55:28

We got next year.

Josh: 55:28

Oh for sure yeah um but yeah it's it's a fun time and if you're uh if you're ever hesitant about trying to go out to one of these events it really is worth your time you will enjoy it.

Pamela: 55:38

I'll say this I have felt more welcome in a gay bar

Josh: 55:46

Oh yeah

Pamela: 55:47

than I have in a church.

Josh: 55:48

Oh one million percent yes yeah yeah

Pamela: 55:50

There have been churches I have gone to where no one talked to me no one like where when I go into the gay bar I I'm not harassed sure but I mean people are just having a good time and they're they're just joyful and they're yeah and they're hilarious. Oh my god the humor

Josh: 56:16

yeah

Pamela: 56:16

oh I live for the humor

Josh: 56:18

yeah

Pamela: 56:18

I live

Josh: 56:19

it's it's a lot of fun but yeah anyhow we're excited for Dallas Pride this weekend um it's gonna be a real blast and uh yeah it's it's something that if you didn't attend if you're listening to this and you didn't attend then you should feel some FOMO because you missed out.

Pamela: 56:33

So yep yeah so uh if you do go we'll be like you mentioned with the LGBT outdoor um trailer or

Josh: 56:43

Yeah their their float that they're building on top of the trailer.

Pamela: 56:46

Yeah I'll be there with your wife.

Josh: 56:48

Yeah

Pamela: 56:49

In the parade so come up and say hi.

Josh: 56:51

Yeah

Pamela: 56:52

I won't have this shirt my my free mom hug shirt on but I will give all the free mom hugs um I love it I absolutely love it um maybe I'll get a pin. I'm sure somebody there will have a pin but yeah looking forward to it. Well that's it for premeditated opinions for the thoughts more fully baked and only mildly regrettable. If you enjoyed today's episode congrats on having truly excellent taste and podcasting opinions. Following us on YouTube and Instagram is a quick and easy way to support us. So if you like literally anything about today's episode please like and subscribe.

Josh: 57:31

Also send us to someone who needs to feel seen dragged or both. We'll be back next week with more unsolicited insight and emotionally responsible spiral and until then please stay hydrated and behave yourself in the comments but if you don't at least make us laugh