Ron 0:00

If I can teach you how to memorize the president of the United States, he was like, cool. And uh that video. Can I look at it? Yeah. Okay, I'll tell you how many views that video got. And it changed everything for me. So what today's around June. What is today? June 21st? It's 21st.

Pamela 0:17

It's Father's Day. 21st, yeah. Yeah.

Ron 0:19

21st. Okay, how crazy is this? One year ago exactly, June 21st, 2025, I started doing this um June the 17th.

Josh 0:28

Okay.

Ron 0:29

So so it's been almost one year. I started with 13,000 followers.

unknown 0:33

Okay.

Ron 0:33

And 1.8 million now on Instagram. 100% organic. But this was the video that changed it all.

Pamela 0:48

You're listening to premeditated opinions because yes, we thought about it, and then we said it anyway. I'm Pamela.

Josh 0:55

And I'm John. And we are two people who somehow share a brain and decided to weaponize our brains with microphones. Each week, we unpack anything, from politics and religion to carpool dread and everything in between.

Pamela 1:08

You know, it would really help us a lot if you followed us on Instagram and YouTube. Giving us a like and a follow is probably the best thing your thumbs will do today.

Josh 1:16

We are not experts. We are just way too confident in our own opinions. With all that being said, let's get started. Welcome back, everybody, to Premeditated Opinions. We are thrilled uh to be joined by two-time USA memory champion Ron White. Uh he is joining us on a podcast today. So it's it's a big day over here at Premeditated Opinions. He is by far um the person that we've interviewed who I think has had the most fascinating existence in the world. Um and so I'm I'm thrilled for you all to get to know him a little bit. I've known Ron for um many years. I think so I met you when I was working at Jim Rohn International when you were involved there with Kyle Wilson and that whole crew, and that was before I was married. And I've been married 19 years.

Pamela 2:04

Wow.

Josh 2:05

So that means you and me have at least known of each other at the very least for I think 20 years. Does that sound right to you?

Ron 2:12

Well, it does. So I don't know when you went to work there, but I met Kyle in about um twenty twenty twenty-three. Oh no, no, no, no. Two thousand three.

Josh 2:22

Yeah, yeah, that that track. So because I think I have this this vague memory. So when I worked at Jim Rohn, I started out there as just a warehouse guy. So so for those that don't know, real quickly, the the Jim Rohn International, the business, um the the piece of it that I was involved with was the publishing side. So they they're basically I'm I'm gonna this is probably uh shortchanging it a little bit, but they helped a lot of independent authors publish materials um in a lot of the personal development arena. And so I was just a warehouse lackey. Like I was I filled boxes and put UPS labels on them and stacked them ready for the trucks. And so I have a memory of meeting you for the first time when you walked back into the warehouse and you were looking for one of your own books, and I think I showed you where it was, and we just chatted and you were around some, and I just remember being like, this guy's cool, he's he's interesting, like there was a lot going on. Uh, and so like what phase of your career were you at in 2003? Like, what was why were you at Jim Run International at the time?

Ron 3:33

Well, um, what happened was uh Chris Widener, who was is a speaker, he had a relationship with Kyle back then. And um Chris and I had met each other through the Zigz working with Zig Ziggler.

Josh 3:46

Okay.

Ron 3:47

So uh we Chris and I had become friends. I didn't have a relationship with Kyle, but Ky Chris did. And um Chris Widener said, Hey, you know, um, do you know Jim Rohn International's down the street from you? And I'm like, Yeah, I do, but you know, he said, Have you ever taken your courses over there and asked them to sell them? I'm like, There's absolutely no point to that, Chris. You know, they have every speaker in the world wanting them to sell their CDs and their courses. Will you it's no, I'm not gonna do it. It's a waste of time. Uh and I, you know, I felt like a little bit of an imposter syndrome, anyways. Why would why would they even want to sell my stuff, right? But Chris said, look, I've told Kyle that you're bringing the stuff, I've put in a good word for you, do it. So I um got my CD, and I I remember the office was in South Lake, Texas, and I opened up the door and and uh and Crystal was the administrative assistant, and I had like one foot out the door, I still wasn't fully in, and one foot in the office, and I wasn't like fully in it. I I said, Hey, uh, could you give this to Kyle Wilson? And Crystal said, He's here, he's in his office. You want to talk to him? I'm like, No, I don't. And give it to him. And then uh, you know, like Kyle got it, he went through it in whatever way he wanted to, and then like maybe a week or two later, he said, Ron, how much would you sell 2,000 of them to me for? And I'm like, this is my course, and I've never sold 2,000 to I have no idea, you know. And um I think they were like $97 we were selling them for. And I said, Well, I'll give you how about 50%. So I'll sell them to you for $50. He said, Ron, that's not how this works. Uh, you know, this is let me explain this business to you a little bit. I need a lot better price. And he explained the business to me, but I sold 2,000 to him that day. Uh two weeks later, he called me, said I need 2,000 more. Uh, a week later, he called me and said I need 500 or a thousand more. So we sold 5,000 in a month or six weeks. And that was the beginning of my relationship with Kyle, which really turned my business around, and that's how I met you.

Josh 5:46

Yeah. So so what was on those CDs? Like what when you're so you have a relationship with Chris Widener, and he's encouraging you to do something with these products you're creating. What was that product?

Ron 5:56

It was called Memory in a Month. So it was uh third 10 minutes a day for 30 days to develop a superpower memory, right? How to remember names, how to give speeches without notes, how to remember what you read, how to learn anything faster. And um uh so they loved it. And and and back then, Jim Rohn had Chris was creating this product with Kyle, like a one-year success plan or something like that. Is that what it was called? Yeah, I think so. Yeah, that means well. They one of the months they made accelerated learning. So that's why it was a good fit for what they were doing.

Josh 6:29

Yeah, yeah. So, so on that, uh I I know a little bit about this just because we we were working together and I remember just being like in my time at Jim Rohn International, I tried to actually engage with some of the products that were there because I kind of was in a unique place where like I I was surrounded by all this personal development material, and that wasn't ever really something I explored, but I was just like, okay, it's here, and I'm just gonna start reading stuff. And so I would just pick stuff off the shelf that was appealing. I'll be honest, not everything was a home run, but but I remember like I remember listening to that to your course in the warehouse while I was working, and so like I do have some memory of that, which the irony isn't lost for me. I only have some memory of it, but um, but no, the the the I remember how structured the system was that you were teaching and and all that. So, how did you get to a place where you were actually teaching this kind of content to begin with? What was the genesis of your passion around memory and and the things that you've really built a career out of?

Ron 7:32

Well, uh, so uh well I actually uh you know the high school reunion. I was talking about I had my high school reunion last night. Uh it's been five years. We had a five-year reunion. Um yeah, that's right. Yeah, somebody said to me, You look you look the same. I'm like, I look a hundred percent different. Whatever. We both do, buddy. But um right after out of high school, so two weeks out of high school, my friend Brian said, Hey man, let's get this job at this company that cleans chimneys. And I said, All right, so we as a telemarketer were calling people all day long, and it was just so it was so random, like a j telemarket telemarketing job at a chimney sweep sweep company. And one day, what they had you do is all the telemarketers, which is about six or seven of us, we would all line up in this line, and then they would have the Arlington phone book on this particular day, and we got in a line, and then we got up to the phone book and we tore out everybody tore out a page. You can just tore out however many pages you want. Wow. So if I had gotten one person behind or one person ahead that day, or if the person in front of me had torn out four pages instead of five, but the way it all fell, I tore out my page, I went back to the phone book and I called this guy one day and I said, Hey, we want to clean your chimney. And he said, I don't want my chimney cleaned, uh, we're trying to sell our house. And I said, Sir, if you're trying to sell your house, you should have a clean chimney. And he was like, You know what? I don't know, you're right, but I don't want my chimney cleaned. But I do want you to go to work for me. You're a good telemarketer, you just tried to overcome my objection. So uh he offered me a job and he sold memory seminars.

Pamela 9:16

Wow. Yeah.

Ron 9:17

So I went to work for him the next day, and that was July of 1991. So 35 years ago. Wow. I know that's yeah, that sounds impossible because twenty look 27, but I'm not yeah, yeah. I was 18, 18 plus 35, and uh, or that's what I am now. Yeah. And uh so it's all I've done really for the last 35 years. I've had to take jobs, you know, here and there, jobs as a waiter and stuff like that in my 20s because uh couldn't pay my bills and wasn't getting enough speeches. Right, yeah.

Josh 9:44

Yeah. So when when you actually jumped into all of that, like obviously there was there was some sort of growth process that was necessary. Like you weren't you just said it, you had to pick up jobs here and there to make ends meet. When did things really start to turn the corner for you? Was that when you engaged with Kyle Wilson and Jim Rohn International, or were you already kind of making a living by that point doing this kind of work, doing giving speeches and and teaching the memory training?

Ron 10:06

Yeah, I well, I had been given speeches for 10 years at that point. Um I almost exclusively for free. I I never got paid to speak until I was 28, so right before I met Kyle. But no, my business business was not going good. Yeah, uh, I was in debt to the IRS by about $40,000, which is not an insurmountable amount, but when you're not even barely making that, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, it was an insurmountable amount. Yeah, I was uh in debt, uh struggling, and you know, I always say if I had never met Kyle Wilson, I'd be living under a bridge in a cardboard box, and it's probably not so, you know, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Josh 10:51

So like when in those early days of speaking and and all that, like I I have not I am not a public speaker, I am a working musician. I so I know what it is to be on stage in front of people, I know what it is to bring energy to a space and to keep a crowd with you and things like that. When you think of kind of those early days, is there anything that stands out to you that like that you were getting right early on? Like when you were getting on stage and and really giving it your best shot, was there anything you look back on now and think, I was doing this the right way, and maybe these things just hadn't developed yet? Like, well, do you have any sort of of memory around that kind of thing? Because I like thinking about that in in terms of my own career. Like I like to reflect back and be like, oh, yeah, this I was doing this well, and I can see now at this phase that I really had a lot of work to do in these other categories. Does any of that resonate with you?

Ron 11:38

Yeah, I mean a hundred percent. You know, what I was doing well was I was building my speech, right? It's the same speech that I was given in 1993 for free is the speech I will give next week for L'Oreal, the cosmetics company, their annual convention, and get paid fifteen thousand dollars. It's the exact same speech. But what I was doing right in the 90s, giving it for free, is perfecting that speech, right? Giving that speech 20 times a month, 250 times a year, 2,500 times in 10 years for free. Just in I mean, it my speech now, people will say, Hey, we knew we were getting memory training. We didn't know we were getting a comedy show. Right. But the reason they feel like they're getting a comedy show is the first in 1993 I give the speech, somebody laughs at it, something I say. I say, Oh, well, that's staying in. I didn't I didn't plan that, but that's staying in. Right. And then in 1995, I say something, and it's people laugh. I say, Oh, that's staying in. So now it's the speech teaching memory, but it's fun the entire time because it's I I remember all the jokes. So it's my highlight reel of my 90s condensed into a speech. So that's what I was doing right, and that's why that time was invaluable to me. What I was doing wrong is I was doing my own taxes, and I was doing them two or three years late, and I always owed the IRS money. I mean, I owe the when I met Kyle Wilson, I owed it $40,000. Uh in 2000, even in 2012 or something like that, I owed the IRS $120,000. It was just outright. I didn't have an accountant, I was doing it all on my own. I wasn't organized. I'm still not organized, but I have a good CPA. Right. You know?

Pamela 13:17

And that was part of the evolution.

Josh 13:19

Right. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. No, that's that's really interesting. Uh so I want to get into talking a little bit about um the Afghanistan memory wall because this is one of my favorite things that you do. Um, and I have such tremendous respect for it. But I want to get there by way of talking a little bit about your military service. Um, and so would you break down just a little bit for us of like how you engage with the military, how and why you engage with the military and just the path that that puts you on to getting to wanting to do a project like the Afghanistan memory wall?

Ron 13:56

I said this is pretty much all I've done over the last 35 years, and it is. I in my 20s, I took a job as a waiter to pay bills. Uh, I took another job and it wasn't to pay bills. Uh matter of fact, I lost money because of it. I hate, well, you can't say you lost money, but I made less money because I did it. Um but um so I started in 1991 as a memory speaker. In 2001, a decade into my career, I'm 28 years old, and 9-11 happens, right? So me and my friend Brian, that I've been friends with since I was 11 years old, uh, we we were sitting on his couch shortly after 9-11. We're both 28 years old, and he said, Hey man, don't laugh at me, but uh tomorrow I'm gonna join the army. And you know, he'd been my closest friend since I was 11, and it just it made sense. I mean, it it it it it it made sense. And it I it was not a decision I gave more than half of a second thought to because I knew instantly it was right for me. And so after 9-11, we went and we joined the military uh as a response to 9-11. Um, we both served eight years as a reservist. Uh he was deployed to Afghanistan in 2005, I was deployed in 2007. So that is the genesis of the tribute. If I had never joined the military and served in Afghanistan, this idea for this project that I do now would have never happened. But what the project is, is um in 2012 I began memorizing everybody who died in the war in Afghanistan and the order of their death. Uh the first one we lost is on my wrist right here, Master Sergeant Evander Andrews. He died October 10th, 2001. And the last one we lost and they all thirt 13 died at the same time. So how can you say it's the last one? But the one I've chosen to represent the last one is HM3 Max and Soviac, August 26, 2021. So on my wrist I wear the first and the last, which signifies all of them to me. And there's 20 uh 2,468. Um and I know all of them. I memorized them. I know the rank first name and last name. I probably, you know, well, I don't want I don't want to say that because it sounds like I'm boasting and I don't want to I don't want to boast about a project that's meant to honor the follower.

Pamela 16:14

Yeah.

Josh 16:15

I hear that, but at the same time, it it's it's a remarkable use of your unique skill set. It's a remarkable use of um it's a ro it's a remarkable thing to just have done in general. And so like uh you you've always operated around around this with a lot of humility, and I I had the distinct pleasure of I don't even remember exactly how this all happened, but I there was a season where I was doing some pretty consistent video work for you on and off. Um just little YouTube stuff that I think YouTube even then was not anywhere near the engine that it is now. And so we were we were producing some video content together around the time where you started doing events with the memory wall. And when we say the Afghanistan memory wall, tell us a little bit about what the actual structure is because you're writing what when you take when you do an event with the wall itself, you pull a trailer that has your the literal physical wall on the back of it. You show up, you assemble that wall, and then you write it. Tell us a little bit about that process. Like when you show up someplace, how long does it take you to get it set up? How long does it take you to actually get all these names written? Like, what is this like for you in execution?

Ron 17:27

Yeah, um, so you know, in 2012, I had by that point I had won some memory championships rights, set some records for memory and that kind of thing. And then my record started getting broken. My I lost my, I was dethroned as the memory champion for the United States. And I thought, okay, what you know, I can't stay stagnant. You know, I'm I'm uh my memory championship days are probably over. I don't think they are. Actually, I don't think they are. Uh I'm 53 now. Uh I don't know when, but I'm I'm I'm gonna go back. It needs to be in the next five years. Okay. I'm over 50. There's never been an over 50 memory champion, but there's never been an over 60 for sure. So uh, anyways, but at that time it was over for me, right? Yeah. So um uh I said, what am I gonna do? So I said, Well, I'm gonna memorize pi to 100,000 digits. That'll get me in the Guinness Book of World's Records.

Pamela 18:26

Whoa.

Ron 18:26

Yeah. So how far'd you get? Whoa. I got I spent a couple weeks and I got maybe to 2,000 digits or something. Um God. That's still right. Incredible. Insane. Yeah, but it's a system. So but then I remember I was at the Texas Rangers baseball game, and I was sitting there, you know, that's how I would memorize. I would always take what I was working on with me wherever I went, and I'm somewhat of a loner. I'd go to 40 baseball games a year, and 38 I was alone. So I would just sit there with the with the the Guinness Book of Rules, not the Guinness Book of Rules, Pi, and I would be just memorize it, right? And I remember being there at the Ranger game. I remember the instant moment I was there, I started calculating the pace I was at and how long it was gonna take me to get 100,000 digits, right? Yeah, and as I did it, I thought this is gonna take a year. Yeah. And I'm like, okay, I'm okay with that. I'm okay with that. If this is gonna be the greatest memory achievement of life and it gets me in the Guinness World World Road, I'm a hundred percent okay with it.

Josh 19:24

Yeah.

Ron 19:24

But then I thought, is that meaningful to me? Like having a hundred thousand numbers in my brain, is this will I enjoy this? And I'm like, I'm not gonna enjoy this at all. And who's ever gonna say, hey, will you write out pie for maybe they will. Maybe they will. Like, maybe there'll be a podcast or a TV show that's gonna, but it's gonna be rare. Right, totally. So then I thought, well, what is uh meaningful to me? And somebody uh asked me around that time, how long would it take you to memorize the uh Vietnam Wall? Oh and there's 59,000 roughly on the Vietnam Wall. And I said, I started doing the math. I can I I memorized 155 names in 15 minutes at the USA memory championship. So I started thinking, okay, 155 names, but that was just first names, or it wasn't first and last. Uh the Vietnam Wall is first and last, so it's 60,000 plus double it. So now it's 120,000. I did all these math calculations in my head, and I went, I my answer was I could do it in two months. Something like that. I gave the answer. Something like I don't remember what the answer was. This was 15 years ago. But I was so wrong. I was so wrong. I wasn't allocating, that was such a naive answer, but I wasn't allocating for the time of review and memory, right? There's so but as I was thinking, I'm gonna do the Vietnam Wall, that's it. That's a project I can get excited about. It'll take me less than the get us the the the pie. Yeah. But then it just one day all made sense. I served in Afghanistan, nobody's honoring them. We were doing Memorial Day stuff, but there's no there's there's currently no Afghanistan wall. I'm like, I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna create the Afghanistan wall. So I memorized everybody who died in the war in Afghanistan, and I travel around the United States with a wall. It's 52 feet long, it's eight feet high, it looks like the Vietnam Wall in the sense that it's white and it looks like marble, but it's a dry erase board. And I'll set it up at a NASCAR game, a sporting event or something, and I will begin writing at like 7 a.m. And I will write for 12 to 13 hours till 7 p.m. And I write out it's 7,500 words and I'll write it out from memory.

Josh 21:39

So I mean, for starters, that uh my it makes my head spin to even think about trying to do anything like that. If I often don't know where my laptop is. So like it that's that sounds so intimidating. But like you've now been doing this for the last fifteen years or so. What are some Events or moments that have really stood out to you in that time where where you know as you've either things you've been invited to that that really were special or moments that you had as you were uh in the process of writing out all those names, like what has stood out to you and been and been special in that time?

Ron 22:16

The most special thing about it all is getting to know the families, getting to know their stories, and letting them know that that somebody cares. That's the most special thing. Now, with that said, there's been some moments that were special to me. And it doing it in front of the Alamo, you know. I had the wall set up in front of the Alamo and I wrote it out there, and you know, I'm setting it up, and a Texas state troop will say, You need to move this wall down there, nothing goes in front of the Alamo. And the mayor of San Antonio walked up and said, The wall is fine right here. And he was like, Whoa, okay. Yeah, but that's not the moment that was special. Not not him getting not him getting rebuffed. The moment was special that was writing the names at the sacred grounds of the Alamo, right? And uh people probably writing the wall. And I mean, it's it's it's got 2,500 names on it. At that time it had 2,000 because this was 13 years ago. And unfortunately, in in 600 had died, 600 more died since that moment. There was a person looking at this isn't a special moment, it was a funny moment. The person was looking at the wall, and I when somebody's looking at the wall, I always say, Are you looking for a specific name? And they were like, Yeah. So are you looking for a specific name? They said, Yes. So which name? And they said David Crockett. That was a different war. That's a different war. Oh man. That's awesome.

Pamela 23:36

You should have just written it in real quick. Oh, it's right here.

Ron 23:40

You know what? You know what? That break that does bring up a special moment that I wasn't gonna tell, uh, that I wouldn't even have thought of. So I was doing this at the um there was a double header on in uh Arizona on Memorial Day, and my friend Chris Widener had a connection with the Diamondbacks. So he said, Hey, the Diamondbacks will let you do this at their double header on on Memorial Day. I said, Awesome. Well, guess who they were playing? Texas Rangers. Yeah, it was just so perfect. Yeah. When I was there, somebody walked up to the wall and they said, Is this name on the wall? And I have them all memorized. And when somebody says a name, I know if it's there or not. And I'll be able normally I'll be able to say, Yeah, it's number 722, and I walk them over to it and I point to it. But this kid, 18 years old, 17, 15 years old, said, Is this name on the wall? And I'm like, No, sir, I don't I don't think it is on the wall. And so I got up my phone and I Googled it and I said, Oh no, man, he's not on the wall. He uh he died in Iraq. I'm sorry, I'm sorry for your loss, but I this is for Afghanistan. And then I said, How do you know it? And he said, It was my dad. And uh I he's the only person who's ever written on the wall other than me. I gave him the marker, I said, Man, why don't you put your dad's name on the wall? Nice. So that was a special moment for me, and it was a special moment for him. And I wouldn't have thought of it had you said about write it on the wall.

Josh 25:02

Yeah, yeah. No, that that's so cool. And like I I've I've enjoyed following all of that storyline, I mean, from day one. It it's such a a cool project to conceive of. It's it's gotten a lot of attention. I know it's gotten you some really cool opportunities and and some exposure. And at the same time, I know, and you've said it in the context of this recording today, that you're not trying to draw attention to you. And I really respect that about it. Like, this is something that you're doing out of a sense of just responsibility and connection and being able to use a unique skill set to do something that that honors something that you're passionate about. I have a tremendous amount of respect for that. Um you've also done some other really interesting things. Uh actually, one of the things I meant to ask you earlier on. So I introduced you as two-time USA memory champion, Ron White. What is it literally, what does it mean to say you're a two-time USA memory champion? Like what things did you have to be involved with? What did you do to win that title twice?

Ron 26:06

Right. Um so one thing I I will want to say, I don't want people to think I'm trying to claim to be overly selfless and overly humble because I'm a human and you know I I have selfishness and and and ego too, right? But so one, I'll button up the Afghanistan wall without sure so I'm not sure trying to portray unlimited selflessness and unlimited humility. Um I'm very careful about the Afghanistan wall. And when we do the wall, when people ask, How did you do this? We never say, well, he teaches memory training seminars. We you know what I'm saying? So I try to remove as much benefit from it as I can, right? The way we answer the question is is well, he used to hold the record for the fastest memorize a deck of cards, so he knows how to memorize, and he served in Afghanistan. We never we never say I have a business, I don't wear my business shirt, right? So we because it's it's a tribute, it's a memorial, and I want those gold star families to know, hey, he's handling this with care. This is about our fallen. However, I do know, I do know it is a massive memory project and it's really unmatched for current memory projects of any of anything anybody's doing, in my in my opinion. So that does build credibility for me, right? Of course, and so the credibility in my brand, so and I'm 100% aware of that. So let's go now to your question of what is the USA memory championship? Yeah. It's it's the it's a really large nerd tournament. And like you're in good company. We are yeah, um it's uh it's a series of events. Uh when I competed, it was seven events. It's a it's morphed a little bit now. And I don't exactly know the right exact format now, but it's very similar to the same. So what it is, it's seven events. Event number one, they hand you a sheet of paper, and this piece of paper has 200 photographs on it. And underneath the photographs, it has their first and their last name. And then it lets you look at it for 15 minutes and you and you're just looking at it, memorize as many names as you can. You get one point for every correctly spelled first and last name. So, really, you want to focus on the names that are easy to spell, right? Right? Yeah, and you don't want nope, you don't want to go for all 400 points because you're not gonna get it. Right. Um, well, I mean, but at least that's my strategy. And I was the champion, you know. I mean, I'm sure there's some numbskulls just going in order, trying to memorize everybody's name. I'm like Miguel Cutty, nope, I ain't memorizing McGill Cutty. Stephanie with an eye, I'm sorry, I'm not doing that one.

Pamela 28:45

Okay, so they don't have to be done in order. You just have to as many as you can memorize.

Ron 28:50

Yeah, and here's the thing. So it in the the the organizers know this and the memory, they call them mem mental athletes. The mental athletes know it. If you could memorize it in order, you would not have to attach the name to the person, right? So if it's a picture of you and it's a picture of you, and it's and underneath you it says your name and it says your name, well then they give me the the photographs back, and you're still the first picture and you're still the second picture. Uh I wouldn't even have had to attach it to you. Right. I would have just had to memorize it in order, which is what I did for the Afghanistan wall. Yeah. So that but that's not the the exercise. The exercise is attached to the person. Right. So they'll have 200 photographs, and then when they give you the sheet of the 200 new names, the photographs are all jumbled up. Ah, got it. So, which is it very important. Um, so that's event one. Uh my best score for that's 155 names, you know, points. And then the next the next event is how many numbers can you memorize in five minutes? So they'll give you a sheet of paper and it's got about 400 digits on it, and they'll let you look at it for five minutes and then they'll take it away. And then they give you a sheet of paper with nothing on it but blanks and a pencil, and you write out how many numbers you can recite that you just memorized. Um, I held the the national record for a while. Uh I memorized 167 digits in five minutes. Um, and then that was so that's the second event. The third event is how fast can you memorize a deck of cards? Which it's every ever it's most people's favorite event because it's like if you say I held the record for the fastest to memorize a deck of cards in the United States, that's like wow. If you hit I held the record for the most names memorized, it's still cool, but there's just something about cards, right?

Josh 30:40

Yeah, yeah. There's a casino element to it and all that. Like we're all fascinated by that.

Ron 30:45

So uh that event is they have a deck of cards right there. They say go, you picked it up, shh, looked it as fast as you can, set it down. I held the national record for that. I did it the fastest ever at the time in a minute and 20 uh minute 27 seconds. Um, and the way that happen works is is you look at it and then you set it down. So when you set it down, that's your score, right? The time. Got it. And then they give you five minutes to reassemble a second deck and and see if it's right.

Pamela 31:13

Right.

Ron 31:14

So uh how many names can you memorize, how many numbers can you memorize, how many uh uh deck, how fast can you memorize a deck of cards? The next one is how fast can you how many words can you memorize from a point? That's the first four events. Then they take that score. Typically, there's about 50 people competing at that point. They take that the the score, and the top eight people move to the to the championship round. Wow. And it's good like the playoffs, right? And you got and I'll I'll run through this really quick. Um there's eight people on stage, eight people up there, and they give each of you a list of 100 words dog, cat, lamp, sock, fan, pool, right? Everybody memorizes the same 200 words. They take the paper away, so we've all looked at the same words. They give the microphone to Josh, you say the first word, they give the microphone to Pamela, you say the second word, they give the microphone to me, I say the third word. Wow. Keeps looping around all eight people.

Josh 32:14

That seems harder to me than just going from the top. Like, I don't know. Oh man, that's really I didn't know that.

Pamela 32:22

Because because yeah, because if you mess up, uh-huh, is that gonna mess me up?

Josh 32:26

Exactly.

unknown 32:27

Yeah.

Josh 32:27

If I skip a word, are you now yeah? Oh, that's that's a good one.

Pamela 32:32

Yeah, yeah.

Josh 32:33

And then if let's say, Josh, you forgot a word.

Ron 32:37

See you later, Josh. Now we're down to seven people.

Pamela 32:40

Wow.

Ron 32:41

And when three are eliminated, we go to the next round. So now there's not eight, there's five on stage. And the next round is um where I got eliminated in 2008, the first year. They have five people walk up. Person number one, they all say the same thing. They all give the exact same information in the same order, but it's personal to them. Person number they all say, This is my name, this is my birthday, month, date, year, this is my city and state where I live. This is my zip code, this is my my uh 10-digit phone number, you know, with area, it's with an area code, this is my um pet's name, the type of my pet, and the color of my pet. These are my three favorite foods, these are my three favorite hobbies. It's 15 pieces of information, and I might have left out one in there, but it's 15 pieces of information. And so he says 15 pieces, the next person walks away, that person says 15, and they give it all to us, and we're all just sitting there listening. We do have some, some, we do have a the a paper that has what they're saying, so you can listen and you can read at the same time, um, which helps because really what most people do is they just stop listening and they just start memorizing, right? But you have to at least listen to this is my name. And and and and I and I learned this. It was not I learned it on the spot. They gave me the papers. I thought I ain't gonna listen to these people, I'm just gonna memorize this. But as I was doing that, it clicked in my brain. Dude, you at least got to memorize the name because you have to know that all that information belongs to that person. Yeah, and I don't know why, but it didn't click in my head till I was on stage. Yeah, so then they'll go back through there. There'll be they'll they'll say, person number three, walk up here, and they'll say, Pamela, person number three, tell me their phone number. Josh, person number two, tell me their birthday. And uh you make some mistakes, and then those people are eliminated. And then the last round is they'll give us all the same deck of cards in exact same order. Two decks shuffled together, 104 cards. And then you will say the first card, you will say the second card, I will say the third card. You make a mistake, you're out. Last person winning is the USA memory champion.

Pamela 34:50

So, how long does this event last?

Ron 34:53

The the when I competed, it was a one-day event. So the four events that where you elimin where you get the top eight, that's morning, and then the championship is in the afternoon. It normally goes about one to four, one to three thirty, and they have the champion. Now they do it a little different, and I think they do it different because they have lumosity as a sponsor, and I and so they've involved Lumosity games, right?

Josh 35:18

Yeah, I'm I'm familiar with those. It's like mobile games, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's mobile memory training. Right. Yeah. Yeah.

Pamela 35:24

Okay.

Ron 35:25

Uh yeah. Yeah.

Pamela 35:27

So so what's the difference between what you do and having a photographic memory, or is it the same?

Ron 35:33

No, it's nothing the same. And also, um, it's photographic memory is almost really a myth. Okay, almost people say uh he has a photographic memory or she has a photo. Almost nobody does. Almost nobody. Now there's some guys like Stephen Wilshire. I don't know if you know who he is. You probably might have seen him, uh but you just didn't know his name. Have you ever seen the video of the guy where they take up in a helicopter and they fly him over Rome or New York City and then Oh, and then he he draws it by memory.

Pamela 36:04

Yeah.

Ron 36:05

Clearly. Yeah. That's the clearest definition of a photographic memory. They fly you over Rome for two or three hours, and then you recreate it from memory, and they will say that if there's a building and it has 17 windows, when he recreates it, there's 17 windows. Yeah. I mean, it is the most unbelievable thing I've ever seen.

Pamela 36:23

Yeah.

Ron 36:24

If that's how you're going to define photographic memory, and that's how I would define it. I'm not going to say somebody has a good memory is a photographic memory. It's extraordinarily rare. Now there are people who have good memories, right? But what I do is 100% a system. 100% system.

Josh 36:38

Yeah. So I know one of the things that you've been leaning into recently in the content that you're putting out on YouTube, which all of you should follow Ron on YouTube, you should follow him on Instagram, you should follow him on every other social platform. I'll make sure he has a moment to kind of inform us as to where all that lives.

Pamela 36:53

And we'll put it in the description.

Josh 36:54

Yeah, definitely. Um, but the I know one of the things you've been enjoying recently is you're kind of doing some man on the street style stuff where you're just walking up to people out and about and engaging with them and and teaching them. And so how has that gone? Like what what what kinds of things are you doing in this man on the street sort of style? How's that been going? Oh, it's phenomenal. Yeah.

Ron 37:18

It's it's one of it's not I can't, I don't know what the greatest thing I've done in business other than starting a business. It's definitely the best thing I've done in the last 10 years. Um so I hired, I I've been walking up to people and saying for a while, hey, I memorized this book. Pick a pick a pick a page and I'll tell you what's on it. And I did that at a uh a conference called ClickFunnels, um, their marketing conference. And I've done it with some other stuff. You know, I memorized the constitution, so I'd be like, hey, say here's the constitution. Say a couple sentences and then I'll pick up where you are. But I never did it on video. Well, I did, I was on a Chad Prather podcast. He's a guy who has a podcast. I did do that on video once, but typically I was just doing it more like to get attention at conferences or something. Well, I went to this guy, Andy Elliott's house, and I handed him the book. I said, Hey, Andy, here's your book. Pitch pick a page number. He said 72. I said, Ah, the what you talk about on that page is this. He said, Man, Ron, that's fascinating. You need to do you need to go out on the street. So I had been doing it. I just hadn't been documenting it. Right. He said, You need to go on the street, you need to approach strangers, you need to say, excuse me, sir, to establish that you don't know them. I'll give you $50 if you will um write 30 numbers on this sheet of paper. And and and if I can't recite it, I'll give you 50 bucks. So I did that. I started going out to the stockyards here in Fort Worth, and I walk out to people and I'd say, excuse me, sir. Uh if if you can write a 30-digit number or a 50-digit number, if I can't memorize it in two minutes, I'll give you 50 bucks. And I kept doing that. It was going well. But I got, I was, I was like, you know, I mean, my brain gets tired. I mean I'm 53 years old. You know what I'm saying? And I'm kind of, and I know I've said that like 10 times. I'm more making jokes about it than anything. Yeah. It's, you know, I mean, you can whoop my ass right now.

Josh 39:05

Yeah, all the jujitsu you're doing and all that.

Pamela 39:07

No, I think uh I got to 3.14 and I was done.

Josh 39:11

That's the extent of my pie knowledge. Yeah.

Ron 39:14

You know what? Um uh then let's then let's do something. Okay, let's do something. Let's do something. Come on. So, and so when I um was got I got tired one day, I turned to my assistant Amy, who follows me, and she's been with me 10 years. She's the longest relationship of my life. I say that all the time. I have friendships with guys like Josh and Kyle. You know, she I tell her that you're the longest relationship of my life. Yeah. Um, she uh she's very tolerant of me, and I'm very tolerant of her.

Josh 39:48

I mean, that is the secret to great relationships, is being able to put up with each other. Yeah. Yeah.

Ron 39:53

Um, so I got tired one day and I said, Hey, told Amy, I ain't I'm tired memorizing stuff. I'm gonna make somebody else memorize something this time. And I walked up to somebody and I said, I'll give you, I'll give you $50 if I can teach you how to memorize the presidents of the United States. He was like, Cool. And uh that video. Can I look at it? Yeah, okay, I'll tell you how many views that video got, and it changed everything for me. So what today's around June, what is today, June 21st? It's 21st.

Pamela 40:25

It's Father's Day. 21st, yeah. Yeah.

Ron 40:27

21st. Okay, how crazy is this? One year ago exactly, June 21st, 2025. I started doing this um June the 17th. Okay. So it's been almost one year. I started with 13,000 followers.

Josh 40:41

Okay.

Ron 40:41

And 1.8 million now on Instagram. 100% organic. But this was the video that changed it all. Um, I got tired of memorizing stuff for people. I'm you know, I'm like, come on, I got more value than just being a uh a computer magician or whatever. My real value is not in me memorizing. The real value is not that I held the record for the fastest to memorize a deck of cards. The real value that I provide to life, to people, is that I could teach you, that I could teach you and add value to your life. So I walked up to this guy and I said, I'll teach you how to memorize the presidents. He said, Okay, I posted it, it took off. This video has got 3.1 million views, all organic, and 161,000 likes, all organic, 20,000 uh shares. And that's when the light bulb flipped off of me. People were only gonna watch me memorize a number so many times. Right. But if so, let's do this. I'm not gonna give y'all a dime. I'll give y'all a half out if I could teach you how to memorize more than 3.14. Okay. All right.

Pamela 41:45

Okay.

Ron 41:46

So um, to remember anything, you need two things. You need to create a picture for it, and you need to attach it somewhere that you know, somewhere that you can go to and get the information later. So it's like think of a uh a file on your laptop. If you put everything on the the desktop of your laptop, you got 2,000 icons there. And sometimes, honestly, sometimes my lap my lap, my desktop looks like that. And then I say, Pamela, go get this file, and you look at the desktop, and there's 2,000 icons, you're gonna you're gonna find it. It's gonna take you forever. But if you have folders, and you probably do, yeah, and when you go back and you get the information, you just go to that folder, right? So memory works the same way. You can't just throw stuff on the desktop of your mind, you need to put it in a folder, which is a physical place that you can actually see most times. There are some some exceptions, a physical place that you can actually see, and you go back to that physical place and you retrieve the data, right? So let's do this. Let's establish physical places that we can go back and we can store data at. So first place is gonna be on the top of our head, right? Okay. So what's number one? Top of your head. Top of your head. Um we already know 3.14, but let's memorize the 1.4 anyways. Okay. For 1.4, let's think of 14 karat gold. Okay. So uh Josh, your head is made out of 14 karat gold. It's about time. Pamela, we can make your hair made out of it. We can't do that with Josh. And uh so Josh and I are in the same boat. So imagine this is your hair, your your head is gold, and the gold, but we can't just have gold. It needs to be full of action. So it's melting. So what's melting on our on our head? Gold. Gold. So three point one four one four for 14 karat gold. The next one is three, one five, one five. So let's take a one high five. Let's use our nose. I'm gonna high five your nose, high five your nose. One five. Yeah. One high five. Yeah. So let's say it now. Three point one four one five. Now the next one is nine. So a cat has nine lives, right? Uh baseball has nine players. Which resonates more with you?

Josh 44:00

I'm not much of a cat guy. I'm gonna go baseball.

Ron 44:02

Yeah. Baseball? All right. So imagine um somebody throws a baseball at you and you miss it, you don't catch it, and boom, it hits you in the mouth. So that's represents nine. But it's there's also pain to that, so that's good. So what's number one? So it's three point one four and four. One five nine. Now, uh, do you play the drums for some reason? I think you I do. Okay. So you got two sticks, right? Two sticks for the drums. It's the next two is two six. Okay. Okay, so two sticks for two six. Let's make our shoulders where we're gonna store that data, and we're playing the drums with two sticks on our shoulders. So what's the next number? Two six. So let's say it all together. Three point one. One four one five nine two six. Now the next one is a series of three numbers, five, three, five. Okay. So for five, early we used a high five. So we're still gonna use that, a five. So we're gonna use our hips and our belt here.

Josh 44:59

Okay.

Ron 44:59

So a five here and a five here, right? So it's five, five. In the middle, let's imagine um for for for the number three. What do you like better? Do you like a tricycle? Do you like a tree? Do you like a pyramid? What do you like for the number three?

Pamela 45:15

Tricycle's fun. Tricycle. Tricycle.

Ron 45:17

Okay. So imagine there's a tricycle riding circles around your belly button.

unknown 45:21

Okay.

Ron 45:23

Okay. Okay. So it's five tree three five. So what's that number? Five three five. So let's start at the top. 3.15.

Pamela 45:32

1415926 535.

Ron 45:37

The next one we're going to put on our kneecap. And we're gonna we're only we're only gonna use our body so we're clearly getting to the finish line. Right.

unknown 45:44

Okay.

Ron 45:45

We're not going to a thousand digits right now. Um uh I want you to for we we decided that um nine would be a baseball, right? So in memory, you gotta be consistent. You can't make you can't make a baseball nine here and then use a cat here, right? Okay. So I want you to see a baseball on your kneecap, and you're you decide, man, I'm so hungry, I don't eat anything. I'm gonna eat that. And you just eat the baseball. You ate a nine. Okay, right? Okay. So what is this?

Pamela 46:14

Eight nine.

Ron 46:14

Eight nine. Okay. Now on our feet, I want you to see another baseball, but this baseball is severed. It's on your foot there and it's chopped all up. It's a severed nine. Okay. Okay. Now let's see if so yeah. So what is this? Okay. So let's say it all together. I don't have no idea how many digits that is, but I'll count as we go. 3.141595.

Josh 46:45

Nope. Oh. 26. 26. 26. Yeah, 535.

Pamela 46:54

899. 97979.

Ron 46:55

Yeah, first 14 digits of pie. Yes. Okay. Yeah.

Pamela 47:00

So that is 3.1415 926 535 8979. Yeah.

Josh 47:09

Booyah. Booyah, baby. Yeah. He owes you $50.

Ron 47:16

So that's what I would, that's what I do on the street, right? That's awesome. Approach people, teach them something. If I told you, you know, hey, I bet you I can teach you how to memorize the first 14, 15 digits of pie like that, you'd be like, no way, I'm terrible. I couldn't do it. And that's the magic of the the Instagram videos. I find somebody on the street, teach them to do something they never think they could do, plus it has a little bit of suspense. You know, I'm not Mr. Beast, but adding money does add a little bit of suspense, you know. So it has the money element, it has a challenge element, it has something that people might be interested in knowing. And um, that video got three million views. There was one other video, and I really credit it for launching my Instagram. Um, I was never gonna do anything religious, you know. I just wasn't, you know what I'm saying? I was uh I just wasn't, yeah. But I was walking down the street and I saw this guy in a shirt said Jesus won. And uh so me and my assistant have a thing where if I see somebody that is good, that I think is gonna be good, fun, you know, kind of like kind of like a process right. They always pick people they think are gonna be fun. You know, they're oh come on down! They're like that, you know. That's who I'm looking for. Yeah. So I saw this. I whenever I see somebody that I think would be good, I'll point to my assistant, and I'll just so when I point to her, she knows to hit record. So I see this guy, his shirt said Jesus won. I pointed to her, and uh, I did not normally I'll have it planned. I'll have okay, I'm gonna teach the the presidents today, I'm gonna teach the pie, I'm gonna teach this, this, this, this. This was not planned. And my assistant was confused because we'd already done everything I had planned that day. So I see it says Jesus won. So I point to her, I walk up to him, and I had learned about five years ago the Ten Commandments using the fingers. Um, one, there is one God. Number two, don't bow down. Number three is don't take the name of the Lord in vain. This looks like an M, right? So imagine this M and it's on your mouth. Don't take the name in vain. So I walk walk up to this guy and I taught him all the Ten Commandments using the fingers. That video. Oh my gosh, that video was it's got 11 million views. Whoa. 694,000 likes. Wow. Not seven, not six hundred and ninety thousand thousand views, likes. Yeah, 300,000 shares. This video right here, let's see, I'll scroll down. It I got a hundred and thousand 130,000 followers from that video. Wow. So that's which is 10 almost 10% of the entire year. So that's what those two videos combined is what yeah took me off.

Josh 49:59

So when you look when you are get hired to go speak at these conferences and all that, like like you've you've obviously got quite a following. That following has really exploded in the last year. I I know that the question I'm asking you is actually a part of some of your presentation, but why is this an important skill for people to have? What what value are you adding to their lives by them being able to memorize names and memorize data and things like this?

Ron 50:22

Right. So if um it and and you just hit on the points, like what what value in life is gonna know and pie to 14 digits? You know it. You could now, right? That's kind of neat, but what how's that gonna add value to your life? It's probably not. But if you're a cool parlor trick. That's right. That's right. That's right. It is a business conference, won't hire me to teach them a trick, right? Right. So, um, what the business people want to know is there's a car, there's a car dealership, and there's a say the their sales guys or somebody's walking up to them and saying, I want to talk to my wife. And then the salesman says, Okay, well, when when you talk to her, let me know and I'll I'll hear back from you. They never hear back from them, and they don't make the sale. But there is a way that you can still respect the man's wife, but there's a way where you can structure it to still close the deal, right? And I don't know what it is, but it is over how to overcome objections. How do you as how do you how do you remember your objections under pressure? So Pamela's selling a car and the person says, you know what, the price is too high. And Pamela says, you know what? You're kind of right, you know, or whatever. Or she'll just say, Hey, you know what? I'm so sorry that the price is so high, and you lose the sale. But that car dealership has a script that when the customer says the price is too high, you reword it and rephrase it, and then the customer's like, oh wow, I guess the price is right. I will buy it. So if a business person can memorize their scripts, if if a if a CEO can get up on the stage and give his company presentation and not look lose any notes, he's more charismatic speaker. Giving speeches without notes, remembering scripts, remembering names to build relationships, right? So there's so much value in business and having a good memory, but there's also value in school. You know, you're in college, you're struggling, and you've got a big test, and you need to know, you know, all the stuff for the history test, memorize it using the system that I kind of described. So that's the value to having a good memory.

Josh 52:21

Yeah. Awesome. So I wonder if I could ask you to show off just a little bit. Um, you taught us something, but I I I want to just give you an uh give you an opportunity to to sort of represent a little bit what you've talked about. So when you were talking about the Afghanistan memory wall, you you talked about um, you know, someone who was walking up and looking for a particular name, and obviously you you know those names in order. So you use the number 722. Do you know what number 722 is? I do.

Ron 52:48

And so and and the way I'll answer this question is I'm gonna be really careful about how I answer this question. Sure. And and and here's why. Um it's somebody's son, right? It's somebody's husband. And um uh so when I answer the question, I will, but I don't want the answer to be amazement. Okay, I want it to honor. Sure. Um, and then I'll do something else to show off. How's that? Great, perfect. That's Sergeant Brock Shavers. Okay, and and uh, and it's it is important to me. I'm probably the only person who knows all of them, right? Sure, I'm sure that's true. And uh, and so I get to honor him that way. Uh, if you do want to give me a chance to show off, do you do y'all have a pen or a notepad or anything?

Josh 53:36

Uh I can get one. All right, so what can I do, Mr. White?

Ron 53:39

All right, I'm gonna ask you for numbers two digits at a time, and I'll alternate here and kind of go at my pace. So whenever I say got it, I mean let me control the speed. Okay. Um, but uh give me a two-digit number, a number between ten and ninety-nine.

Josh 53:54

Okay. Uh 22.

Ron 53:56

So write down two two on the piece of paper. Okay. And I'm gonna ask you to write it out in a horizontal row. Got it. Um Pamela, a two-digit number.

Pamela 54:04

Twenty-nine.

Ron 54:05

Twenty-nine. Okay. Um Josh. Uh forty-one. Forty-one. Four one. Uh all right. Um Pamela?

Pamela 54:18

Eighty-four.

Ron 54:20

Eighty-four. Okay. Uh Josh? Uh seventy-seven. Seventy-seven. Um Pamela?

Pamela 54:31

Nineteen.

Ron 54:33

Nineteen. Okay. Um let's go to thirty-five. Okay. Uh thirty-five. One second. Let me let me think here. Uh 35, okay. Uh Pamela.

Pamela 54:49

Eight.

Ron 54:50

It doesn't need to be two digits.

Pamela 54:52

Oh, it has to be two digits, sorry.

Ron 54:53

It doesn't have to be, but let's make it two digits. It could be eight something in the eighties.

Pamela 54:58

Eighty-seven.

Ron 54:59

Eighty-seven, okay. Um, Josh. Twenty-two. Twenty-two. No, we already did twenty-seven. No, let's go ahead and do it. It's already locked in. All right. Twenty-two. That was the first number, and that was the ninth pair. So it was the first pair and ninth. Um, Pamela.

Pamela 55:18

63.

Ron 55:19

63, okay. Uh Josh? 51. 51. Okay, Pamela.

Pamela 55:29

Forty-nine.

Ron 55:30

Forty-nine? Okay, Josh. Thirty-six. Thirty-six. Uh Pamela?

Pamela 55:41

Seventeen.

Ron 55:42

Seventeen? Okay, hang on one second, Josh. Uh uh. All right, uh, Josh. Ninety-one. Ninety-one. Okay, I'll stop there. That's 30 digits. Okay. Okay. So I don't know if I'm gonna get this 100% right or not. Let me pause for one second here and and think about what we've done.

Josh 56:04

Uh sure. And and for anyone watching on or for anyone listening on the audio, this would be a great opportunity to jump over to YouTube and watch this on video. So if you are just listening, that's great. But also watch this on YouTube.

Ron 56:15

Okay. I believe that number, and I'm I just say it at single digits. That's just typically how I do it. Okay. I believe that number should be pretty close. Don't know if I'm gonna get it 100% right, pretty close to uh 22294184771935, and then uh 8799, and then uh 63514936 um 17. I'm right so far, right? Just about. Oh well, uh other than the last one, did I mess up in the middle there? There's one, there's one okay tell me tell me the number that I got right before it. 87. 87. Oh, I said nine nine. And it's two two. Yes. Okay, so now I'm perfectly right. Yes. All the way up to the very last one.

Pamela 57:06

Yeah.

Ron 57:06

And you know what happened? Okay, so I got don't don't tell me this. Do not don't don't tell me this number. Nope. Uh so that should be the number four words, with the exception of the last one, right? Correct. Okay. I'm gonna delay telling you the last one, and I'm just gonna say, now let me say it all uh completely backwards, okay, with the exception of the last one. Okay. Um going completely backwards with the exception of the last one, it is seven one and then uh six three nine four and then one five and then three six two two and then um seven eight and then five three and then nine one seven seven and then four eight one four and then uh the number there's nine two two, is that right? Yes, okay, with the exception of the last one. Now let me see if I can figure out this last one. This might take as much as 30 seconds, but let me see if I can if I can figure this out really quickly.

Josh 58:12

I'm not gonna put you under any more dress. That was incredible all by itself. Like I can't do anywhere close to anything. Yeah, that's really amazing. So, okay.

Pamela 58:21

Forwards and backwards, yeah.

Josh 58:23

Like that's ridiculous. Um, so tell everybody where they can find your content at this point. If you want if someone wants to engage with you on YouTube, Instagram, everywhere that you are, tell people how to find you.

Ron 58:35

Brain Athlete. If it's my my website's brainathlete.com, my Instagram's Brain Athlete, my YouTube is Brain Athlete. Search Brain Athlete and you'll find awesome, awesome.

Josh 58:44

And if someone wanted to maybe hire you to come in and speak, how does that work?

Ron 58:48

Well, go to brainathlete.com and same conduit. Yeah, yeah. Fill out the form and any any conference, or or you want me to do a half-day training for your company, anything like that.

Josh 58:57

Awesome, awesome. That's so great. Man, it's just been such a pleasure to have you. Um I I know that you know we've we've been we've been friends a long time, kind of stayed in touch on and off. Uh, you know, we've run into each other here and there, and and when we started this podcast, one of the things that Pamela and I talked about was like we want we want to bring on people that that we engage with and think are fun and and uh are just interesting to listen to, and you have been all of those things and more. Um so I'm I'm just thrilled that you said yes. Thank you. Right. Um, and you know, I I hope nothing but but huge success for you. Um, but yeah, we are we've kind of reached uh the end of our time. And I yeah, I'm so grateful. So thank you for making the drive out and spending time with us. Um thank you, uh those listening for letting us back into your ear holes for another premeditated opinion. We're just thrilled that you're here. Um please, please, please give us a follow on Substack. That's a base best place to engage with our content. Um, you can also become a premium member there for uh some additional stuff. Um we're also on YouTube, we're on Instagram, we're on Facebook. We're are we on TikTok? Yes.

Pamela 1:00:00

Kind of I think I got it.

Josh 1:00:03

All right.

Ron 1:00:03

91. That's it. Now we're done.

Josh 1:00:10

I got that perfect. 91. That was so on I can't think of a better way to end than on 91, which might be what I would titled this episode. It's 91. Uh, but thank y'all so much for joining us. We're thrilled that you're here. Uh, please be back in a couple of weeks for more content that will hopefully be somewhere as compelling as this episode has been. Thank y'all so much for joining us.

Pamela 1:00:35

Well, that's it for premeditated opinions, where the thoughts were fully baked and only mildly regrettable. If you enjoyed today's episode, congrats on having truly excellent taste in the podcast. Following us on YouTube and Instagram is a quick and easy way to support us. So if you liked literally anything about today's episode, please like and subscribe.

Josh 1:00:57

Also, send us to someone who needs to feel seen, dragged, or both. We'll be back next week with more unsolicited insight and emotionally responsible spot. And until then, please stay hydrated and behave yourself in the comments. But if you don't, at least make us five.